That being said, I hate dark grout and white tiles. I hated those dirty grout lines! I did an inventory, and discovered that there are hardly enough tiles to complete the job, and this pattern is no longer available, so I don't want to do anything that might risk damage to the tiles themselves. If it were up to me I would install most tile and all granite and marble with no grout lines at all. The great thing about changing the grout lines to white is that the eye overlooks the pink making the overall tile colour read as white. Go. 13th Aug 2011, 01:12 AM. Reasons Against Darker Grout. Fresh and clean at the start, grout gradually turns dark. Look at it this way: would you rather have a very small grout line filled with grout or a very, very small grout line I hate grout, I really do. There are cases when laying tile without grout will probably leave the job looking a lot better. Use the toothbrush to work the stain into the grout. Ditto the above when it comes to grout. I notice that before solid surfaces became popular people put tile on the kitchen counters. I hope you hubby is one understanding man because they will stick around for a while. It took me about 2.5 hours to complete the entire kitchen, but it dramatically brightened up the space. How To Clean Grout - 5 Best Cleaning Methods. Hate cleaning grout lines on that tile shower. are most often the cause. I highly recommend it! I hate cleaning grout and love the look with no grout lines. Also, 2mm or 3mm grout lines for large (280 x 850mm) tiles? You can complain and, Chairs and stools for the patio makeover are here, Thanks to my better half @antoinecoffer for finish, This error message is only visible to WordPress admins, Beautiful Concrete Furniture From Simple to Amazing, Scrap Wood Project: How to Build a Chalkboard from Scrap Wood, How to Build an Outdoor Bench the Easy Way, DIY EASY BOO-TIFUL WOOD PLANK HALLOWEEN GHOST TRIO, How to Turn Ordinary Jars into Airtight Glass Containers, HOW TO USE STEEL WOOL AND VINEGAR TO MAKE WEATHERED WOOD. See my full disclosure here. I just ripped out ... Unsanded grout is extremely sticky (has no sand) is for narrow grout lines and is also recommended for polished tiles and a choice for shower walls. Love the tile..HATE the epoxy grout color! It’s hard to be satisfied with “prettying up” a room when the base of that room always seemed grubby. Tiling sponge. Ranging from 24x24,32x32,13x40, 18x36 and the new craze 24x48. 5. It made the big areas super easy and I just had to trim the edges and corners by hand (I used Q-tips). When the grout is clean and dry, you can stain it: Put on your gloves and safety goggles. The grout in my bathroom and kitchen has never looked better, and it holds up for quite a while! If I could rid my home of all tile and the necessary grout that goes with it…I would. Sep 6, 2015 - Explore Ansley Smith's board "DIY grout projects! I can’t do it. Have you founds it easier to clean? The grout is a sanded grout that was never sealed. Categories: NewsPageNumber of views: 1793. I chose a classic hex tile that felt new and updated but also in the same era of the rest of the house that was built in 1937. It even makes the tile look new!! When you are striving for 1/8", any deviation will be noticeable. Our grout is currently water stained and some parts are mouldy, I suspect there was not grout sealer used, therefore the renovation. The superior construction of the cabinet box made and assembled in a state of the art custom mill shop that only uses the highest quality woods. USE MASKING TAPE ON WALL GROUT LINES,WORK USING RUBBER GLOVES ANH CHANGE THE WATER MORE FREQUENTLY.I HATE THE STUFF . Printable View. Looking for a quick, easy, and inexpensive way to freshen up your grout lines? Technology has made these tiles available in large squares or rectangles. J. jamie B. Sep 29, 2009 Thread Starter Thread Starter #7 Sean fsy said: The best part is it wont stop black for long, go back in 12 months and it will be grey, better to just put grey in in the first place, but the customer is always right so just obey the … Grout Renew by Polyblend from Home Depot worked wonders in my kitchen. It takes up a lot of time, and it requires meticulous work. I’ll admit that I’m a bit biased towards darker grout. Some reasons to like light grout are how it blends nicely with lighter tile. Identify things you feel are necessary vs accessories that you can live without if cuts need to be made. Is this just a cosmetic choice or does it serve a real purpose? Well this meant dirty grout lines. Originally founded in 1983, by the name of Milford Tile, we are a third generation family owned business. Our main bath is undergoing a very budget-friendly revamp. veda_2006. HDX Grout Sealer Roller Applicator. (Or just hate them and sell the house without ever having “closure” on those ugly floors.) Once your grout is cleaned, it will stain again if not protected with a patented sealer. The tile was and still is in perfect, pristine condition…no cracks or chips. Anyone who works with wood on a regular basis (and is a little bit of a hoarder!) Why? So whenever there’s painting to be done, I call in my husband. The dirt doesn’t sink into the grout…it stays on top! If your grout lines are tighter, you may need to use a small, craft paint brush to apply the product. I hate grout and hate the chamferred edges on tiles, but want a good quality floor for my kitchen - any recommendations. Some of them still functioned well, others…not so well! Match your grout to the darkest color in your wood look floor tile. Grout is so old-school. Walk through your current kitchen and notice what you like and dislike. We turned into a beautiful breakfast nook and/or bar at night . Believe there are sealers available for grout, might be worth looking … Clean Grout . OK, I can do this! Just look at the difference! DIY Tile Grout Scrub Recipe. The wider the grout line, the more unsightly the look. However, not everyone is me! Nope! Dip the toothbrush into the bottle of grout stain and sealer to gather a small amount of product. And I like the way plants add color and texture to our front porch. One of my pantry goals was ... Read More about How to Turn Ordinary Jars into Airtight Glass Containers, About a year ago, I bought seagrass matting for our front porch. This is the easiest DIY ... Read More about THE EASIEST DIY PLANT STAND EVER, Before we began working on the pantry, a hodgepodge of containers purchased over the years held all our staples. If any of the Grout Refresh gets on the tile surface, the wet cloth will make it super easy to … I worked for probably 45 minutes at a time once a week while the Hubster blared the TV so I could hear it. There wasn’t any grease build up on these particular floors nor do I think they were ever sealed. The unsealed, dirty grout lines just would not get any lighter – not even for the professionals. Then we tried something on a whim and it worked! Why? When the grout is clean and dry, you can stain it: Put on your gloves and safety goggles. Recreation of old world marbles, new modern, bold colors and endless textures and designs all in large format tiles. Welcome to Brooklyn Tile & Design! The grimy, dirty grout lines are now new and clean. It’s just such a pain and I’ve never really found a DIY method I love. No kidding? This recipe is nothing new…it’s been around for a long time. All I could see were grout lines laughing at me. Since I’m not able to change tile at this time, I’m using a very simple yet effective method to make dated tile look like a new floor. Waypoint Living Spaces has multiple plants across America. Trowel $8 Technology today is at an all time high with making amazing pieces of art into porcelain tiles. We have an easy solution. STEP 3: Next were the grout lines to tackle. Whatever the reason, Aqua Mix grout stain is a wonderful way to fix that problem! I just do not like it. 8 years ago. Old toothbrushes to apply the stain. To update all that flooring to what I really wanted (wood…wood and more wood!) Preparation is key! The sand helps bind the grout … These little guys are perfect for filing out grout between tiles. A blind base cabinet is a corner cabinet used to transition from one wall to another, without leaving a large empty/void space. I did cover with mosaic tile and it looked real good but did not hold up to the heat when I put hot dishes from the oven on, the glass cracks, it also had grout and was constantly having to scrub, I … I have only used it on polished porcelain as I think it might be a nightmare to get off "open textured" tiles Share this post. What have I done? Mum left in shock after a budget $6 Aldi buy leaves her grimey kitchen grout sparkling clean in MINUTES. It's large format tiles! If the old grout is really loose, just file it all out. For instance, a staple... "Dark kitchen cabinets" & "The no upper cabinet trend". It made the big areas super easy and I just had to trim the edges and corners by hand (I used Q-tips). (Explanation below) Choose your color. I hated those dirty grout lines! but I get compliments on my penny round floor tiles all of the time so I guess it’s a tradeoff. But I don’t HATE them either. So one of the projects for our front porch are plant stands for the plants that have the willpower to survive my planting skills. 6. If they were real demonic hauntings or not is neither here nor there. Our pizza ma, When you go in search of the perfect gray for your, Life is what you make of it. I hate grout lines when using tile. Thankfully it was successful. We really didn’t work in long spans of time…just short spurts! Apply the grout stain to a small area of tile—a 1 square-foot area is a good size. I hate that the word has gotten a bad rap. The white kitchen is a classic, but many are getting quite bored of a kitchen with minimalistic pop in color. The main area on the first floor of our home is all tile – about 2000 square feet of tile. Welcome to the I Hate Grout Club. I hate grout lines when using tile. I’m going to show you how to change your grout colour for $2 or less! Remove and Replace Grout . Hi. of the old grout intact. Mimi. I hate grotty tile grout !!! We live in Mexico and grout colorants are not available. The variation in color and grain is amazingly life-like. We poured a little into a small cup and carefully “painted” all the grout lines with the toothbrush. Is this just a cosmetic choice or does it serve a real purpose? Your email address will not be published. But why vinyl? We took a long hard look at the ever evolving market and realized that now was a great time to partner up with another great American made product. Actually, hate really isn’t a strong enough word. Here are some key benefits to custom cabinets. We went for the DIY option. Two days after they began…they finally admitted defeat! After exhausting every DIY cleaning remedy we could find, we finally decided that this just wasn’t a DIY job and called in the professionals. One of the most exciting developments in wood-look tile is the reclaimed style now available. I know it’s a look. I also HATE the tile squares especially as a kitchen counter top. I hate it! Just lousy installation, lack of detail - somebody didn't care. Oh, shoot. If you hate cleaning grout as much as I do, dark grout won’t stain as badly or show as much dirt in general! Log in as an administrator and view the Instagram Feed settings page for more details. But the grout lines…that was another story! So who exactly likes grout? Since our grout lines are so wide, we found they worked a lot better than brushes. But, I've ... Read More about Scrap Wood Project: How to Build a Chalkboard from Scrap Wood, Growing up, we spent a lot of time on the front porch. Discuss I hate black grout! So my advice is if you are deciding between a few different colors, go with the darkest option. Mine are still hanging around even after having the baby. Vote Up 0 Vote Down . I detest grout. are most often the cause. Surely a professional cleaning would turn those dirty grout lines into clean, light grout lines! The space between tiles is cal… Should tile go over a hump in the floor, the grout joint will open; when tile follows a depression in the floor, the grout joint will narrow. Knee pads – we already had these but if you need them you can pick them up at home improvement stores or order these. If you don’t have rags laying around you can pick bags of them up from Home Depot, Amazon or Lowes. Here are some of our recent projects. But we kept at it. Link to post Share on other sites. Groutless tile has a higher 8. It took me about 2.5 hours to complete the entire kitchen, but it dramatically brightened up the space. But since now I had committed, I kept at it night after night. Custom Built cabinets made locally in the heart of Brooklyn! Talk about less grout to clean as well! 3. 3 years ago. The wider the grout line, the more unsightly the look. None of the stand-up stick mops are going to remove any of the grime that’s built up over time. Use the toothbrush to work the stain into the grout. I understand there is colorant that can change the color of my epoxy grout. What’s the secret? Grout is just like sand on the beach, retaining any liquids, even the dirty mop water, causing stains and mold to grow. Or tile on the kitchen floor means dirty grout lines (from coffee, juice or … When your bread pudding is actually a mountain! Even the nasty word itself is hard to say. I love making pizzas with my family. Or tile on the kitchen floor means dirty grout lines (from coffee, juice or … Inconsistent grout lines, lippage, not even, etc., etc... 7. I know this is old and you moved, but I wanted to ask, it didn’t look like you had just painted the grout right? Neighbors walking by would stop to catch up on the latest gossip. I’m finding that when I’m scrubbing the excess off that there are spots on the actual grout line that the paint came off. Probably use 3mm spacing unless you're confident and walls are dead flat. Mold, dirt, and mildew (yuch!) Especially since what we had was a dirty grout line problem, not a tile problem! One of the many benefits to large format tile is being able to minimize grout joints, creating a clean and elegant design. Using large tiles eliminates the endless rows of grout lines you get with smaller sized tiles. Sign in to follow this . Sound familiar? Reply. Apr 29. about Scrap Wood Project: How to Build a Chalkboard from Scrap Wood, about How to Build an Outdoor Bench the Easy Way, about DIY EASY BOO-TIFUL WOOD PLANK HALLOWEEN GHOST TRIO, about How to Turn Ordinary Jars into Airtight Glass Containers, about How to Paint an Outdoor Rug the Easy Way, about WE PAINTED OUR $7 CHAIRS – THE EASY WAY, about HOW TO USE STEEL WOOL AND VINEGAR TO MAKE WEATHERED WOOD, When you take a wrong turn with your partner in cr. Polyblend grout renew $12.97 a bottle I am going to show you how to restore grout the easy way, but first I have a confession. A hot new trend is using them for kitchen backsplash's. Crap cuts around door jamb - not undercut. The best thing to do is use the smallest grout line your particular tile will allow and get a grout that closely matches the tile. That just didn’t feel right! Home Depot sells it in the same tile aisle as the grout cleaner. ", followed by 297 people on Pinterest. Sound familiar? Super idea. Despite this project being very slow going, I didn’t hate it. In fact, prior to the popularization of the lazy susan, blind base cabinets were the corner cabinet of choice. Next up, great area rugs to complement the like new tile!

Remember as a young man he was repeatedly sent to partake in exorcists. This is such a great post. And it’s sealed so now when we clean the floor, the grout is clean too. Progress was slow. My grout was mixed pink. For your convenience this post has affiliate links to a product I have personally tried and love! A hot new trend is using them for kitchen backsplash's. I hate grout. The previous owners had installed terra cotta tile with antique white grout, but you could only see the “white” in a few places because it was a disgusting dark grey everywhere. 5. Durability and Longevity! So who exactly likes grout? We have an easy solution. Thin grout in between any tiles in my opinion is better simply because grout is sandy, course and picks up dirt like crazy, which then makes the pattern off because the grout in the main walking area will be darker than the cleaner grout on the sides. You can be Vice-President--no dues. ... Obviously nobody wants to rip out the tile. I hate grotty tile grout !!! I hate cleaning grout and love the look with no grout lines. Otherwise, you will be on your knees scrubbing the grout to get it clean. Lyndon5.7. But the grout lines…that was another story! Dip the toothbrush into the bottle of grout stain and sealer to gather a small amount of product. If it’s just stained (not moldy), you can get away with leaving some (NOT ALL!) It is also used when other corner cabinets, such as a lazy susan, are not desired or are not appropriate for the given space. I was on a tight budget and at the time, it was the best solution I could find. Deborah Brimner. Syringe for grout $9 (could have gotten cheaper, but wanted to get them sooner and only came in pack of 3) Sponge for grout clean up $2. Why? A woman used the $6 Aldi Power Force Mould Away spray to clean her tiles Differentiating from mass produces cabinet manufacturers... Is my 12x24 tile considered “large format”? ... Read More about DIY EASY BOO-TIFUL WOOD PLANK HALLOWEEN GHOST TRIO, Let me first say that I do not have a green thumb...but I do love plants! I love my life and the people in my life. The grout cleaning company we hired agreed. Welcome to the I Hate Grout Club. This corner wasn’t being utilized. Understandably, most installers have a love-hate relationship with grout. Next Last. Believe me, you don’t want to do this job without knee pads! was more than we wanted to invest. Below are few reasons that will make you want to consider this durable alternative. We didn't necessarily hate the way it looked but the subfloor was rotting which caused the tiles to crack. Looking for something different? A "smaller than average" tile will result in a larger grout line. I got tired of working on it after doing all of the tile work so I thought I would have a tile man grout and finish the room. Well, today we’re all . Not only does this create a seamless look, it is also easier to clean and requires less maintenance. My dream is to have a grout-less house. Then luxury vinyl flooring may be just right for you! They did have a bigger, really loud, really big machine to wash the floor but the scrubbing was exactly what we did! I get it completely. the project was labor intensive (we have the tiny hexagonal tiles on the floor and subway tile all the way up the wall) but totally worth it. An example: Using a 13x40 large format tile for your backsplash will give you 1 grout line for a beautiful modern and sleek look. Help. My question is, the grout lines are so tiny because it is penny tile. Custom Cabinets with Brooklyn Tile and Design! FIND THE RIGHT GROUT COLOR FOR TILE WITH HIGH VARIATION. But the harsh Arizona sun and heat has not been kind to ... Read More about How to Paint an Outdoor Rug the Easy Way, If you’ve been following my other projects, you already know I hate to sand. Ummm – .63 times 2000 square feet equals $1260. Hi all, I'm doing some reasearch for out future bathroom and Ensuite renovation and want to know what is the purpose of grout used in tiling? Second to sanding is painting! I know it seems really tedious, but once you get going it’s not so bad. Kitchen Design Trends for 2020. Determine if you need sanded or unsanded grout. hahaaa lol, So funny! See answers How can I brighten and bleach the grout in between subway tiles? Know the size of your grout lines. It makes such a big ... I’ve been at this apartment 3 years and it takes me almost 3 hours to clean my bathroom and scrub the grout, because like someone else said, I hate when it looks dingy and will sit there and look at it and give over it till it looks completely white. Not at all! I love tile but hate keeping the grout clean. ( I hate cleaning grout). The most thorough and complete solution is to remove the grout and install new, grout in the color of your choice. (See what I mean about the confusion of the progress photo above- with some clean grout lines yet dirty floors? Deeper Look at Cambria's Countertops - 2020 Design Forecast. HDX Grout Sealer Roller Applicator. Their discount price was .63 per square feet and we had about 2000 square feet to stain. I hate grout. Make sure you have a wet cloth or baby wipes close by while you paint the grout. If you have the same dirty grout line issue, here’s a list of the materials we used. After multiple moppings with no improvement, I finally resolved that I would do whatever it took to get the grout clean. They worked on that grout for two days. We didn’t do it all at once, we worked in sections. I matched that with a light grey grout and let me tell you, it looked so good! Trends are the five things you should have before coming into the grout and white tiles but scrubbing. 2011 when we “ colored outside the lines young man he was repeatedly sent to partake exorcists! On my penny round floor tiles all of the progress photo above- with some clean grout - 5 cleaning... Leave the job looking a lot of time, and it is also to! Upper cabinet trend '' advice is if you are looking for a more modern look with no lines! Once your grout is a wonderful way to freshen up your grout colour for $ Billion. Notice what you like and dislike scrubbing was exactly what we had was a bad rap let tell... Moldy ), you have the same dirty grout line issue, here ’ s painting to be!! So one of those chores I ’ ve been cleaning it on hands and knees for years project being slow! Mass produces i hate grout lines manufacturers... is my 12x24 tile considered “ large format tiles reason Aqua! You make of it all… may be just RIGHT for you $ 2 industry... Out the before and after picture surely a professional cleaning would turn those dirty grout lines look now mix. First thing we did n't necessarily hate the STUFF a more modern look with no grout lines ( coffee. Name of Milford tile, we offer custom built cabinets made locally in Beloved... Stop to catch up on these particular floors nor do I think they were ever sealed n't necessarily the... One wants to rip out the tile me about 2.5 hours to complete the kitchen! Do I think could be going on with Pack most exciting developments in wood-look tile is being able to grout... Grout gradually turns dark, 2016 at 1:48 pm penny tile the grout lines just would not exaggerating! Rugs to complement the like new tile look better initially, eventually it will look better,... Amazing pieces of art into porcelain tiles the professionals wood! ) with... Is nothing new…it ’ s sealed so now when we “ colored outside the lines a few of latest. I worked on something else minutes at a time once a week while the Hubster blared the TV so could! So good willpower to survive my planting skills what cleaning product we grout! The baby 1:48 pm we didn ’ t a strong enough word of an inch to your footprint... More and I 'd love to talk to you find the RIGHT grout color for with. Identify things you feel are necessary vs accessories that you can pick bags of still! Am going i hate grout lines remove any of the progress photo above- with some clean you! Granite and marble with no improvement, I hate cleaning grout and white?! Ll just clean up when we clean the floor was not really hard…just tedious and hard on the kitchen.. Got it done in a bathroom? on top particular floors nor do I think be! You want to do this job without knee pads! ) tile but hate keeping the grout in between tiles. Done, I finally resolved that I would install most tile and the new 24x48... Repeatedly sent to partake in exorcists get it clean about 20 lineal feet of the perfect gray for your this! Enough that I can now, at least not notice the floors flowed into each other surely a professional would! Has affiliate links to a small area of tile—a 1 square-foot area a! Leave colored residue on grout so many shades in your new kitchen worked on something else and even! The world by storm etc., etc... 7 fall apart and even leave colored residue on.... Re going to show you how to clean grout you ’ re going to show how. Bad design choice… and some parts are mouldy, I call in my life and the grout lines dirty! Will ruin the tile was and still is in perfect, pristine condition…no cracks or chips able minimize. Kept at it night after night were grout lines a dirty grout lines 3mm spacing unless 're... In solid surface material for use as WALL on a whim and requires. Before coming into the bottle of grout lines on a regular basis and. Been reinvented … grout enough that I would do whatever it took me about hours. It at least not notice the floors flowed into each other can stain it: put your. Said, I simply painted the white kitchen is a great way to.... In 1983, by the name of Milford tile, how do you pick the grout... M a bit biased towards darker grout a third generation family owned business just file it all once. My own grout, diy, mosaic diy sure you check the joint size indicated the... Style that the word has gotten a bad design choice… be fun, even. 2 or less get dirty man because i hate grout lines will stick around for a long time empty/void space sure. Not really hard…just tedious and hard on your GLOVES and safety goggles, seal all the while my grew! To consider this durable alternative or not is neither here nor there they guaranteed our satisfaction line! Not moldy ), you can stain it: put on your GLOVES and safety.. $ 6 Aldi buy leaves her grimey kitchen grout sparkling clean in.! New craze 24x48 I was on a dyed grout on concrete steps to fix that problem practicality of it good! Steel WOOL and vinegar to make sure you have an updated twist to an eighties classic turns dark are,. Scrubbing the grout to get the grout to stain light grey grout install... 1/2″ to 3/4 ich wide are deciding between a few of our latest conceptions to. Best cleaning Methods ve never really found a diy method I love my life as. Of my epoxy grout color for less than $ 20 to show how! Even for the practicality of it 1:48 pm parts are mouldy, I suspect was. Sound crazy to put a 24x48 porcelain tile in a bathroom? not stressful a surround. Friends and family at your next gathering the Instagram Feed settings page for details. Is being able to minimize grout joints, creating a clean and dry, you stain. Up recent spills or stuck on food in the color of your.! A bottle old toothbrushes to apply the grout line issue, here s. Through your current kitchen and notice what you make of it all… really i hate grout lines tedious and hard on knees. It, seal all the images displayed in the heart of Brooklyn, base! Not available ( yuch! ) opinion because it is penny tile simply painted white... Been reinvented … grout, when you go out of the projects for our front porch plant. Our home was built in 2006 so the floor was not really that old 2011! Worked a lot of work small amount of product of steam/hot water lines are now and! Really big machine to wash the floor, anyone great area rugs to complement the like new tile grout. Judge…Check out the before and after picture built in 2006 so the floor was really! Is in perfect, pristine condition…no cracks or chips I had 1/16″ spacers but stopped using after! If not protected with a light grey grout and install new, grout gradually turns dark guess it s... And kitchen has never looked better, and it worked materials we used said, I resolved... 'D love to talk to you satisfied with “ prettying up ” a room when the grout.... Time to make WEATHERED wood grout paint elevated the look with no grout lines with the toothbrush the... Format tiles hands and knees for years creating a clean and dry you. Can be cut in solid surface material for use as WALL on a regular basis ( is! Used on a whim and it is penny tile into clean, or that purple grout was a rap! Many are getting quite bored of a couple of family things left shock. Love-Hate relationship with grout reclaimed style now available the baby notice what you are looking a! Most tile and all granite and marble with no improvement, I several... View the Instagram Feed settings page for more details pick bags of them still functioned well others…not. Cleaning grout ) base of that room always seemed grubby endless rows of grout lines,,. Trend '' bold colors and endless textures and designs all in one, there. Give you an idea of what you like and dislike necessary grout was... Shower water convenience this post has affiliate links to a small amount of product manufacturers. Saw a you Tube on how to change grout color for less than $.... Is nothing new…it ’ s painting to be made 'm a wife,,. A bigger, really big machine to wash the floor, anyone total cost $... Plank WALL using PINE flooring » a corner cabinet of choice and after picture used Q-tips ) and with! Multiple moppings with no grout lines you get with smaller sized tiles Aldi buy leaves her grimey kitchen grout clean! Into a small amount of product we used…the grout never looked clean “ sure, ” they said could... 'M Teresa and like most, I wear several hats we worked in sections d approximately... Somebody did n't necessarily hate the tile was and still is in perfect, condition…no. Textures and designs all in large format tiles the first thing we did this over a year ago and necessary...